More Advaita Questions (Part-4)

Note: This article is meant for intellectuals only

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Realized soul

If you can learn from God regarding His state of continuous entertainment from the creation containing both pleasant and tragic scenes, you have become God in this very important aspect. The superpower and producer-ship of the world etc., are not at all required. The spectatorship and the entertainment is the only essence of this creation (Ekaki na ramate- Veda). The spectator of the picture can enjoy equally with God even though the spectator has not produced the film. The producership of the film has no relevance to the enjoyment. In this aspect, the soul and Brahman become one and the same (Advaita). When the sole purpose of the creation is only entertainment and that is fulfilled even without the producership of the world, you are unnecessarily canceling the producership of God by making the world unreal. You have done this because you cannot be God if the producership is real, since you cannot produce the world. Now, since the very essence of the production of the world is attained by you through the equal status of the complete entertainment with God, you need not do this unnecessary crime.

Petitioner (Purvapakshi): You said that the entertainment becomes continuous if you realize the unreality of the world. As You said, there are three levels of unreality of the world. At the first level, forms and feelings are unreal and this level is called as Maya. The second higher level is Maha Maya, in which matter, awareness, light, heat etc., are unreal. The third highest level of unreality is called as Mula Maya, in which the primary energy is unreal. For the soul, the lowest level, called as Maya is only unreal. The second and third levels are equal and higher levels respectively and therefore, cannot be unreal for the soul. For God all the three levels are unreal. The world may be unreal for God because it is totally unreal at the three levels. For the soul, only the one lower level is unreal whereas the other two levels of the world are real. Therefore, for the soul, the world cannot be totally unreal. Due to this God can have continuous entertainment due to the total unreality of the world. For soul, the world is partially unreal (one third) and therefore, the soul cannot be continuously and deeply entertained like God. Therefore, to keep equality in the entertainment of God and the realized soul, at least You have to say that the realized soul is Brahman (God). Otherwise, You are making God selfish. In our theory, Brahman is not selfish, because as soon as the realization comes, the soul becomes Brahman and the world becomes unreal in all the three levels.

Mediator (Madhyamika): For entertainment, the aspect of producer-ship of God is already proved to be unnecessary. Therefore, this aspect is not strengthening the problem of the petitioner to any extent. Even though it is agreed that the producer-ship does not disturb the continuous entertainment, the degree of the reality of the world cannot be overlooked as raised by the petitioner. When the basis of continuous entertainment is unreality of the world and if there is difference between God and soul in the basis itself, how the continuous entertainment, which is the result of this basis, can be same for both God and soul? If the result is to be equal, the basis also should be equal. Therefore, the objection cannot be overruled.

Respondent (Siddhanti): The entertainment is always limited to the third level only. When you are seeing or acting in the drama, the entertainment of the spectator is completely based on the unreal forms, which are the unreal roles and the unreal dialogues and unreal actions, which are only the unreal feelings. The second and third levels (Maha Maya and Mula Maya) are not at all related to the entertainment. In the drama, the low level of Maya is related to the story, dialogues, actions and the emotions that are expressed in the drama. All these items come under the feelings, which are only the forms of awareness. The roles like king, queen, servent etc., are also unreal like the unreal forms of the matter. When the drama is stopped, all these items disappear. The dress used for the roles, actors, stage etc., remain for some time, which can be removed from that place. This is the second level of Maha Maya where the matter, awareness etc., exist as real items up to the final dissolution of the world. The ground, on which the stage is built-up exists permanently, which is the level of Mula Maya. When you see only the higher and highest levels, the entertainment does not start at all. If you see the ground, the stage, the dresses and the actual actors, who are going to play the roles, the entertainment has not at all started in your mind. Therefore, the higher and highest levels are irrelevant to the entertainment like the producer-ship. The whole entertainment is limited only to the third lowest level (Maya), which is a common unreality to both God and soul. The realization of the unreality of the third lowest level can be attained equally by both God and the soul and therefore, the entertainment can be equal for both God and the soul.

The unreality of the world preached by Shankara is thus, limited to this third level only, which constitutes the various unreal forms of matter. Based on the unreal difference between these unreal forms only, the feelings, which are the forms of awareness, are arising. For ex.: a girl is good looking and another girl is not good looking. The beauty and ugliness are the names of these two unreal forms. Based on these unreal forms of matter, the feelings of love and disliking are generated. The basis of these feelings is only the form of the body of the girl, which is just matter. If both die at the same time and the bodies disintegrate, the matter, which is the reality in both is one and the same. Now, the feelings are not different when the matter in both the bodies is realized as the same. The entertainment is essentially a feeling only. Similarly, suppose one girl is red in colour and another girl is black. The light, which is the common energy in both the colours, is one and the same. Just because of the difference in the wavelengths of the energy, the different colours are seen. After death, the common light energy mixes with the cosmic energy and the colours are unreal. Thus, in the second level, matter and light exist as the reality for the soul, which do not cause any feeling. When matter, light, awareness etc., become the primary energy, then the awareness itself disappears and even the basis of the feeling does not exist. There is no need of even dreaming entertainment at that highest level. Thus, you have assigned names to the different unreal forms, which give rise to the feelings. Thus, the unreal names and unreal forms constitute the essence of the whole entertainment.

Shankara says that the world of these unreal names and unreal forms is unreal. The world in this basic level of Maya is causing various feelings and thoughts like love on your family members, neutrality to others etc. If this Maya can be crossed, the knowledge and love to God can be achieved. Since anything related to God is real, both divine knowledge and devotion are real. The form of God is also real based on the same reason. All these apply to devotees also because the devotees are related to God. Therefore, the love on the form of God and the devotees is completely real since the base (God) with which they are related is real. Therefore, the God in human form and the devotee related to God become the items of reality and significance. Thus, in this sense also, the God in human form and devotees attain the equal status of reality. Since both God and devotees cross Maya, the entertainment is equal to them.

Petitioner: The soul (awareness) is creating the imaginary world in a daydream. Such world is a bundle of imaginations, which are produced straightly from the soul. The soul has generated such world, controls any item of such world with full independence and dissolves the whole world into itself. The soul is also generating the imaginary space. In the case of God also, all these are the same aspects. The creation is imaginary world of God, which is a bundle of imaginations of God. God generates, controls independently and dissolves the world finally into Himself. The space in the world is also generated by God. Since we don’t find any difference between the effects, the cause in both the cases must be one and the same. Therefore, the soul or awareness is directly Brahman.

Mediator: Regarding the effects, there should be no opposition because the Veda admits all these aspects. The respondent has only limited scope to the analysis of the cause in both the cases to be same or not.

Respondent: We do not object the effects, since all the Vedic statements stand as authority for all these points. However, we are raising one point that if the soul and God are one and the same, all the effects must also be one and the same. In such case, the soul should act like God in the external world also. The soul should have the same control on the items of the external creation as the God is having. The Veda says that God controls the Sun but the soul is controlled by the Sun. Another fundamental objection is that the awareness (soul) is the product of combined efforts of digestive system, respiratory system and nervous system. The food in the digestive system is oxidized by the oxygen supplied from the respiratory system. The inert energy is released, which enters the brain and nervous system. The awareness is generated by the combined effort of all the three systems. If this awareness and God are one and the same, God also must be the product of those systems in His background. When God is the effect of some other systems, He cannot be the root cause of everything. Therefore, you have to show these three systems in macro level, which generate the awareness or God from whom the universe can come out as imaginary world. In such case, the soul must control this external world, which is his own imagination since he has become Brahman by realization. We do not have any objection if you take the soul as a simile to understand the effect that is generated from God. However, since God and the link through which the world is generated are unimaginable, we can only understand the state of the effect with reference to God. From such simile, you can understand that the world is unreal with reference to God just like the imaginary world with reference to the soul. In the case of soul, we can analyze the effect (imaginary world) as energy. The link, which is the process of production as work can be also realized as energy. The soul can be also realized as a special form of work, which is also energy. However, in the case of God, except the effect (external world), neither the link nor the God can be analyzed. This is the limitation of the simile.

The simile always is valid in certain aspects only and cannot be extended in all the points. Therefore, the soul can stand as a simile in certain aspects. The differences prove that both the compared items are not one and the same. Here, when you have taken the awareness as a direct cause to the imaginary world, on scientific analysis, it can be proved that awareness is essentially the inert energy and here the creator, process of creation and created energy are inert energy only. The same inert energy in association with some special technology is converted into awareness. Therefore, the awareness is responsible for the will and design of the imaginary world. The robot is also imagining and planning with the help of various combinations of the information that is fed. Regarding the soul also, the imagination is not original as that of God. The imagination of the soul is also based on the various probable combinations of parts of information collected from the world. Thus, the basis of planning is also ruled out to infer God as awareness. The planning of God is unique based on genuine creativity since no information of any part is available to Him before the creation. The science has brought the robot exactly equal to the human being in the extent of creativity. But both the human being and the robot cannot stand before God based on the genuine original creativity of God, which is unimaginable. The essence of the awareness, which is the inert energy, is responsible for the generation, maintenance and dissolution of the imaginary world. Therefore, the word awareness stands for the inert energy in its essential form and as a special form is called as awareness. Thus, the soul is the material cause (Upadanam) and the design cause (Nimmitam) simultaneously. Similarly, God is the root material cause as well as the root design cause of this world. However, here God is not directly the material cause, which may be misunderstood as that God is modified and is affected by all the changes of the world. Similarly, if you say God is the design cause directly, God will be responsible for all good and bad deeds. In the case of the soul, the soul is experiencing all the happiness and misery because its material (awareness) is the material of the imaginary world. Since the soul is the designer of all the feelings, the soul becomes responsible for all good and bad intentions. However, in the case of God, God neither is affected by such experiences nor is responsible for the good and bad feelings in the world. Therefore, the item, which is the inert energy that is produced from God, is modified into the world. The will (awareness in essential form) that is produced from God has designed this world.

Neither you can say that God is inert energy, nor God is awareness because the link between cause and affect is again unimaginable. In the case of soul, the imaginary world and the soul are imaginable items, the link between them is imaginable, and therefore, the analysis can prove that the soul has to be responsible for every action and for the experience of every fruit. God is unimaginable and the world is imaginable. The link between unimaginable and imaginable items must be unimaginable. Therefore, you cannot assign the responsibility of any work or the experience of any fruit in the world to God. Due to the unimaginable link, God has no responsibility for the work and fruit. Yet, the world is created by God only (Kartaramapi Sarvasya Viddhyakartaramavyayam –Gita). Even if you say that the imaginary world cannot affect the soul, it is not so. The good and bad feelings are said to have the fruits to be enjoyed by the soul in the upper world. The reason for this is that the soul is awareness and the feelings are also made of awareness. Therefore, the imaginations have equal status with the awareness. A golden ring and the gold lump that is extracted from that ring have equal weights. However, in the case of God, we know that the effect is a golden ring but the cause is not gold, which is unimaginable. Therefore, the material of the world even in the deepest level (inert energy) is not the material of God. In such case, the concept of relativity also cannot be confirmed. The concept of relativity needs the knowledge of the material and its form. For example, gold is the absolute reality and the ring is relative reality. Thus, the concept of relativity gives the knowledge of the process of generation. Here, since the knowledge of the material of the cause is not known, we cannot logically arrive at the conclusion of the concept of relativity. Since the world cannot control itself by itself, the cause is inferred. The scriptures mentioned the existence of cause and thus, form the basis of God.

Petitioner: Scriptures can be imaginations of some poets. You can call the world itself as God, for which no other cause is needed. This is the philosophy of science also, for which you are also giving the value. If we observe the world, there is no need of any cause for it because it is a self-efficient system. The theory of probability can be an alternative for the necessity of the designer and this theory is again in science only. You said that science can be used to explain the world. Therefore, using the science, you can prove that the world is designed by the probability and is controlled by the same theory of probability. Similarly, the destruction can be explained by the probability. Of course, we can accept the inert energy as the material cause and the material that maintains the world and the force that destroys the world. Without awareness we can achieve the answers by associating the items of the world with the probability of collisions and the energetic considerations of the reactions as explained in science. Even the ancient Indian logic says that the atoms guided by probability (Adrushtam) are creating this world and the designs are assigned to the probability only without the need of the designer. Therefore, both the inference and scripture have gone into the dustbin. The theory of evolution as proposed by Darwin can completely explain the production and development of awareness into mind and intelligence in course of time based on the requirements of the nature. The robot with simultaneously working microprocessors proves the production of awareness and thoughts. The information in the chip is always from external world. Even if you believe the previous births, the bundle of information (samskaras) was also fed from the external world only. Therefore, the external feeding of the information into the chip is common. Thus, all the aspects are answered by science.

I was actually atheist (Buddhists or Purvamimansakas) and was based on this concept only. I am converted to become Advaita philosopher by this Shankara through some intellectual trick. Shankara said that I am God. Since I exist, I accepted that God also exists. However, I still remain as an atheist. Even as an Advaita philosopher, there is no God other than me. As per the science, I am a part of the creation, called as God. Therefore, Advaita and science are one and the same. I have not crossed the limits of the world. Only I have changed my name as God.

Respondent: All your argument is undebatable because it is concentrated within the limits of the world. The probability can certainly replace the designer. The cosmic inert energy associated with the theory of probability can explain every aspect of the world without the necessity of God. Therefore, inference can be easily thrown out. We cannot contradict you if you say that the Veda is an imagination of the sages, who were poets. We cannot give special validity to the Veda saying that it was told by God and therefore, it has special validity. Now, since God Himself disappeared, the Veda cannot be a special authority. If the story is this much only, certainly there is no answer from our side. However, before answering this objection, I would like to remind you that the science is completely based on the experimental evidence. The experimental evidence is only derived from the perceived objects and perceived phenomenae. Therefore, before hearing My answer, I should re-confirm that both of you are standing on the science based on perception. Unless you both reassure Me on this aspect, we will not give the answer.

Petitioner and Mediator: If the phenomenae are perceivable and the objects are having the same status as that of the objects existing in this world, we will accept Your answer.

Respondent: My answer is certainly based on the perceivable phenomenae and the perceivable objects, which have exactly equal status with the phenomenae and objects existing in this world. There are several people who exhibit supernatural powers as miracles. The production of the material is perfectly perceived and the material is as real as any object in this world. The existence of the materialized object is continuing equal to the existence of any other object in this world. Therefore, the unimaginable power, which is beyond the science, is established. You have to accept the existence of unimaginability (Maya) and thereby, the possessor of the unimaginable power (God) has to be accepted. Certainly, you have to recognize the existence of some item (either power or power and its possessor) beyond the spatial dimensions of this world. Thus, the exhibition of miracles establishes the existence of something beyond this world and thus, the scripture is not poetry and gains validity. The human incarnation establishes the validity of the scripture through such miracles. Jesus told that He has come down to fulfill whatever was told in the scripture. For the existence of such unimaginable power, the human incarnation alone is not required. Even the devotees exhibit such power.

Once the existence of something above science is realized and once the scripture becomes alive, there will be quest for further discussion on the subject of the scriptures. To create such fundamental quest, human incarnation is not necessary. It is at very fundamental level and every normal human being is meant for such basic concept. Therefore, God has given such superpowers to devotees at all levels so that the fundamental faith and quest on the subject is ignited in every human being. The human incarnation is very rare and cannot cater Himself to all the human beings at such fundamental levels. He comes down mainly to give the final solutions to the discussions done on the subject based on such quest. This is the reason why God is giving the superpowers to several people whether they are good or bad. The propagation of this fundamental concept is to be done at very large level. The Gita says that wherever miracles are found, they denote the existence of the superpower, from which such sparks have come (Yadyat Vibhutimat Sattvam…). The superpower denotes the possessor of the power (Mayinamtu –Gita, Indro Mayabhih –Veda).

Mediator: Do You mean that every cheap fellow exhibiting such powers (Kshudra Upasaka) is God?

Respondent: The verse in the Gita says that the potentiality or power (Sattvam) that is showing the miracle (Vibhuti) is a spark of the infinite superpower of God. The possessor of that spark is neither God nor a spark of God. A merchant has hundred diamonds. Somebody argued with him that there is no diamond. The merchant ordered his servant to bring a diamond from the box and show it to that fellow. The servant did the same. This does not mean that the servant is the owner of the diamond. It also does not mean that the servant, who brought one diamond has 1/100 share of the wealth of the merchant. The possessor of that power may be a devotee or may be a demon. The point is limited only to the exhibition of existence of diamond. The subject regarding the ownership of the diamond is a subsequent topic, which constitutes the spiritual knowledge. Therefore, the exhibition of miracles is also an aspect of the spiritual knowledge. A scholar cannot show the miracle. A demon cannot deliver knowledge. Suppose Ravana is both scholar and possessor of miracles. He has not divine love. He was torturing devotees of the entire world. He is not having bliss, which is continuous happiness. He was worrying on several occasions without happiness. The possessor of bliss and love must transfer the same to others. However, he transferred fear and misery to several. Therefore, all these aspects eliminate the non-God items and show the God. However, remember, all these are characteristics of the medium only and not God directly because God is unimaginable. They direct you to the address of the Lord with collective effort. Thus, special knowledge (Prajnanam Brahma), miracles (Satyakamah), love (Rasovaisah), bliss (Anando Brahma) are the signs revealed in the Veda. They indicate the address of the Lord.

Mediator: A devotee may also be mistaken as God due to his superpowers, divine knowledge, love and bliss. God is missed by margin because any higher level in these four levels can be taken as the highest level and thus, the devotee may be mistaken as God.

Respondent: If you mistake a devotee as God, there is no harm. The next address of God is only the devotee after the human incarnation. God will fulfill everything to your requirement even through the devotee. God is more pleased with the fame of His devotee. The above signs are mainly intended to isolate the demons and the scholars twisting the knowledge. Of course, there is one miracle, which cannot be transferred to the devotee and is limited to God only. That is creation, maintenance and dissolution of the universe. However, unfortunately, God cannot exhibit this miracle to any soul because to exhibit this miracle, first the entire universe including primary cosmic energy should be dissolved by God. If that is done, the individual does not exist and cannot be a witness to the dissolution. When the universe is again created, the individual does not exist before the creation and therefore, cannot witness the process of creation. Arjuna asked Krishna for this single miracle i.e., the real proof of God. However, God gave a vision of this (Vishwarupam) only as there is no other way than this. Thus, Arjuna confirmed Krishna as God by this miracle. Otherwise, Arjuna was thinking that Krishna, being a genius, is delivering the special knowledge based on His scholarship in the Vedas and the Shastras.

Petitioner: If the respondent has established God, I have no objection to accept God if I am God.

Mediator: To say that yourself is God, the respondent has already given the objection that God needs the existence of biological systems to be the awareness. Therefore, the petitioner cannot continue his claim.

Petitioner: The awareness can exist without the background of these biological systems also. At the time of death, the soul is leaving the body and is having awareness. Therefore, awareness exists without the association of these biological systems. Awareness is an independent item existing. When the soul re-enters the body, the same awareness is continuing. Thus, the awareness is eternal also and does not require the systems. The awareness in the body may disappear after death but the awareness in the soul should not disappear in order to experience the punishments given by the messengers of Yama as soon as the soul comes out of the body.

Respondent: As soon as the soul comes out of this gross body, a new body covers the soul. The new body contains all the systems in a very subtle level. The Veda says that the soul coming out of the body is having another body, which contains nervous system and respiratory system (Manomayah Prana Shariiraneta). Therefore, the awareness of a soul is from the new body, called as Yatana Shariiram. The soul experiences the punishment through this body only. The respiratory system needs digestive system and thus, the subtle matter is oxidized to release the inert energy.

Mediator: A soul going to heaven is said not to have hunger and thirst (Ubhetirtva… Swargaloke –Veda). Therefore, the digestive system is not necessary to supply the energy. Then, the nervous system cannot function. Still they should have awareness to enjoy the pleasures of the heaven. Therefore, the awareness exists in the body going to heaven (Bhogashariiram), which does not have these systems. Thus, awareness is an independent item.

Respondent: It is said that the souls go into the upper worlds, take the solar rays as food (Suryoshma payenah). That means the energy is taken from the solar energy. If the awareness is independent, there is no need of supply of energy from outside. This means that the nervous system is existing (Manomaya Kosha) from which awareness is produced in to which energy enters directly.

Petitioner: The angels are having energetic forms (Divya Shariiram), which do not contain any system, but still awareness is present. The angels are not drinking the solar energy as You stated.

Respondent: Even in angels, the nervous system (Manomaya Kosha) exists and since their bodies are energetic reservoirs, there is no need of taking energy from outside. Let us assume that the independent awareness exists in angels without any system in the body. If that is so, the eternal awareness in the body of the angel must be God according to you. If that is so, why Yama, one of the angels said that God is unknowable? He also said that he cannot know God (Yasyamatam, kathametat vijaneyam –Veda). If you do not give value to this Vedic statement, the very angels are gone because their existence is referred by the Veda only.

Effort of Advaita Philosopher is Negative

The Advaita scholar comes fast if he finds the item, awareness. He will make other items unreal and the realty of the object becomes only awareness. He will limit himself to the same awareness, which is present in his human body. Since all the items except awareness are unreal, he will also remain as the awareness, which is the ultimate reality. Now, he will say that the object and himself are one and the same. He is the owner of one-lakh rupees. The other person is the owner of one crore rupees. Now, he will say that the other person is also having really one lakh only and the other lakhs are unreal. Now, he says that he and the other person are one and the same. He will never try to rise to the level of one crore. Hanuman, a monkey, who is the owner of just a hundred rupees, rose to that level. This is a positive effort. The effort of Advaita philosopher is completely negative. He tries to bring down any richer man to his level saying that the extra riches of anyone are unreal. Even if everyone becomes equal to him, he is not worried because his sole aim is not to see anyone richer than him. He is not interested in his rise but there should be no greater person than him. He may not have any benefit but nobody should be benefited more than him. The basic psychology of human beings is in this line only. When the philosophy appears convenient to the psychology, such philosophy is accepted immediately. Nobody will leave that philosophy. Similarly, the Advaita philosopher has reduced Brahman to mere awareness removing His post of Ishwara. Thus, he proposed that Brahman is the ultimate reality and Ishwara is the relative reality or unreal. Since everything except awareness becomes unreal, he is also reduced to awareness only in reality. Therefore, he and Brahman become one in the ultimate reality. He should know that Brahman never retires from the post of Ishwara. Nobody can become Ishwara except Brahman.

When the officer comes back to his house from the office, it does not mean that he has retired or resigned. Though the officer’s behaviour is not expressed by wearing the uniform or sitting in the office, the officer in the house is still an officer for all practical purposes. Similarly, when he is in the office as an officer, you cannot say that he is not the father of his child. Therefore, an ultimate reality (Brahman) is Ishwara and the relative reality (Ishwara) is Brahman. The lump of the gold (ultimate reality) has the potentiality to become the chain. During the existence of ring, the same lump of gold is present. Thus, in Ishwara, Brahman exists in totality. In Brahman, the potentiality to become Ishwara exists. You say that the same Brahman is becoming Ishwara and Jiiva just like the same gold becomes a ring and a crown. The gold present in the crown is one kilogram. The gold present in the ring is one gram. You say that the same gold (Brahman) is present in the ring (Jiiva) and crown (Ishwara) and the difference between the crown and the ring is only in the design, which separated from the gold is unreal. Therefore, the difference between Ishwara and Jiiva is unreal. In reality, only gold exists, which is the Brahman. However, in this simile, all the concepts are not clear. Since the design is a relative reality, the difference between crown and ring can be unreal. Since it is totally unreal, the quantitative difference is also unreal. However, what about the difference in the quantities of the gold present in the ring and crown? Gold is the ultimate reality. Now, the difference is in the ultimate reality.

Petitioner: Since the space (relative reality) is unreal, the quantitative difference of gold is unreal. Only qualitative similarity holds good. You have to treat the gold beyond the space. Such example is not available in the relatively real world. Therefore, awareness is above the spatial dimensions and cannot have quantitative difference.

Respondent: Any item, which is above the spatial dimensions, cannot have even the qualitative identification. If you say that the existence of Brahman alone is experienced as told by the Veda and then if you say that the similarity between the Jiiva and Ishwara is only the existence of some unknowable item, then you can only say that both Ishwara and Jiiva have common existence. This means that the common item of existence in both is Brahman. In that case, how can you say that Brahman is awareness (Chit)? If you confine the Brahman only to existence (Sat) of some common unknowable item, we have no objection. Since the item is unknown, even the existence of such unknown item has no meaning and cannot become the similarity. If the aspect of the similarity is unknown, it becomes meaningless to say that some unknown similarity exists. Moreover, the awareness is not mere existence of some unknowable item. It is an item that can be realized and thus, we use the word self-realization (Atma Jnanam). Therefore, apart from existence, the nature of the item is also known. We are also differentiating the awareness from inert items and thus, the awareness has defined boundaries and comes under the spatial dimensions. Then, how can you say that awareness is above space? Therefore, it is very clearly proved that awareness is an item that can be defined by spatial dimensions.

If you are very fond of the word Brahman, let the soul have that word as its name. We have no objection, because any greatest item in a category can be called as Brahman based on the root meaning. In fact, we are very happy also to call the soul as Brahman because the soul, even though has several negative points of its greatness; it is the greatest in one point, which can be similar to Brahman. Such similarity is that awareness is absent when isolated but still gives its experience. Brahman is unimaginable but gives experience of its existence. The unimaginability and absence can be viewed similar though fundamentally, there is vast difference. The absence means non-existence. The unimaginability means existence, which cannot be understood. In this point, the soul stands as an example to understand the Brahman. Therefore, if you call the soul as Brahman, we will be happy to sacrifice it and we will call the Brahman as Parabrahman from now onwards. It is just like the owner of the one-lakh rupees to be called as the owner of a crore. We will call the actual owner of the crore as a millionaire from now onwards. In fact, even this may be painful to you because in such case, you may like to be called as the millionaire. Therefore, our new name for the owner of one crore is “the person beyond one crore.” Therefore, the word Parabrahman is not having any positive meaning, for which you may be again attracted. It has only a negative meaning that it is something beyond yourself (Brahman). However, unfortunately, you are not agreeing to this proposal and stick to the word Brahman only.

You are saying that Ishwara means the creator, maintainer and destroyer. You have limited Ishwara to this concept and pushed Him to the relative reality making Him unreal. You have clearly understood the reason, which is that you cannot become Ishwara by any path. This concept is built up by yourself and please stand on it. You say that Brahman is the word introduced in the Brahma Sutras as the ultimate reality. The characteristic of Brahman is immediately revealed in the Second sutra as the creation, maintenance and dissolution of the world. If awareness is the real meaning of Brahman, the second sutra should have been immediately “That which is awareness.” If you say that such characteristic is only Tatastham, we have already answered this by saying that the Tatastham, which is constant and not found in any other item can act as Swarupam. If you say that the Swarupam (awareness) is the characteristic of Brahman as told in the fifth sutra, the context of the fifth sutra is not to say the characteristic of Brahman because the context is denying the inert items as Brahman. Therefore, to give importance to the awareness and to remove importance to the potentiality of creation etc., is against the theme of the Brahma Sutras. The theme is twisted by you because you are having mere awareness and you can never achieve the potentiality of creation in your lifetime. This twist is done by you to call yourself as Brahman.

Petitioner: In the fifth Brahma Sutra, even though it is out of context, the conclusion is that Brahman is not inert item but awareness only.

Respondent: In the fifth sutra, the awareness (Chit) is not mentioned. Only the will (Ekshateh) is mentioned. It means that Brahman got a will but it does not say that Brahman is awareness. By the will, the inert item is rejected. However, it does not mean that the awareness is selected. If you say to one student that he failed in thee exams, it does not mean that the second student passed. The indirect sense need not be always the direct meaning. In fact, this sutra gives the broad address step of Brahman that enters the world as incarnation. This means that Brahman enters into a living body and not an inert body because the program of incarnation is to preach the knowledge. Even in the context of Brahman, it wished to create as per the Veda. However, that does not mean it is awareness. In the case of worldly items, such logical analysis will certainly prove the item to be awareness. Brahman being above the spatial dimensions, such worldly logic fails. Since Brahman is the source of every item (dravya), property (guna), form (rupa), action (karma), there is no objection to say Brahman did this or that. Brahman can do everything and therefore, it wished to create.

Theme of the Brahma Sutras Relate to Incarnation

Mediator: You have related the fifth sutra to the incarnation of Brahman. Do You mean that the theme of all the Brahma Sutras relate with the incarnation of Brahman?

Respondent: Certainly, all the sutras can be related to the human incarnation, which was present during the time of Vyasa. There is no difference between Brahman, Ishwara and the human incarnation (Krishna). Ishwara is in the relative reality and it is proved that He is simultaneously Brahman. Since both the human incarnation and Ishwara are in the same reality, there is no objection to give homogeneous status to both. Thus, the human incarnation is simultaneously Brahman and Ishwara. The human incarnation is before the eyes and the medium is the human body and not the cosmos as in the case of Ishwara. The complication and repulsion is more in human incarnation. Therefore, the enquiry is more required in this case. The second sutra refers to vision of Vishwarupam, in which Krishna showed the creation of universe, its maintenance and its dissolution in the vision. This itself proves the common characteristic of both Brahman and Ishwara. The third sutra says the main aim of the human incarnation, which is to preach the spiritual knowledge (Shastram). The fourth sutra says that the medium can be treated as Brahman due to the unity of the medium and Brahman without isolation (Samanvyat) like current and wire. The fifth sutra says that the incarnation cannot be through inert medium because awareness of the medium is required for preaching the spiritual knowledge. There is no need of any tension in such interpretation because Vyasa stressed that Lord Krishna is Brahman and Ishwara as seen in His Bhagavatam.

The human being cannot touch Brahman in the ultimate reality even entering into more subtle bodies of energetic forms after death because even angels in that state declared that they cannot understand Brahman. As far as the existence and experience of the unimaginable nature of Brahman is considered, there is no objection. In fact, such experience of the existence of the unimaginable nature of Brahman is given by the human incarnation only for the humanity through unimaginable actions (miracles) and unimaginable knowledge etc. Otherwise, the very existence of Brahman based on the scriptures will be thrown away by the atheists as poetry. Even you cannot touch Brahman in poetry because it is beyond the imagination of any soul since it is above the space. When the same thing is uttered by angels like Lord Yama, how foolish it is to be heard from the mouth of petty human being? Do you mean that even angels could not understand that Brahman is awareness? Do you mean that Hanuman after studying all the Vedas from the Sun could not understand this small point that awareness is Brahman and therefore, He is Brahman? If you say that awareness (soul) is not Brahman but Brahman is awareness, in such case how can you utter the statement that you are Brahman?

Krishna told that He is the creator, maintainer and destroyer of the world (Prabhavah pralayah…, mai sarvamidam, mamabhutamaheshwaram –Gita). From the point of the awareness, you can also state the same and say that there is no difference between Krishna and yourself. However, Krishna proved what He said by giving the cosmic vision, which you cannot give. You may say that it is only vision and actual proof is impossible because the soul will not exist to grasp the concept in such proof. Accepting this impossibility, which is due to the incapability of the soul only, you can also give at least the same cosmic vision as given by Krishna. Now, you say that all the miracles are untrue. You say that the world is unreal and therefore, Ishwara is unreal. Now, even Krishna is reduced to the mere awareness only so that yourself, Krishna and Ishwara are reduced to Brahman, which is limited to pure awareness only. Therefore, you are always in the circular motion of egoism and jealousy only and you can be never dragged out from this circle. You are going in the opposite direction and finally reaching the place of demons. Your aspired goal can be achieved by you if you come out of this circle and worship the human incarnation like Hanuman, who became Brahman and simultaneously Ishwara at the end of His spiritual effort. You are the most laziest man on this earth because you want to be Brahman without any effort as if you are getting the lost ancestral property through sudden judgment from the court. All the sacrifice and service of Hanuman is the climax of foolishness since He attained the same through lot of effort, which you got in a fraction of second by hearing the Mahavakyam!

Petitioner: If you say that Krishna is Brahman, He himself told in the Gita that He is the awareness (soul), which knows everything (Kshetrajnamchapi mam). He told that there are two items, one is the soul and the other is the body. He also told that He is the soul present in every body (Sarvakshetreshu…). He told that He has entered the human body (Manushiim Tanum…) and He must be the soul since there are only two items (Prakrutim purushamchaiva). Therefore, You are encircled from all the angles and You have no other way than to accept that Brahman is the soul in every body.

Mediator: The word Purushottama also means that He is the best among the souls since the word Purusha has to stand for the soul only. Krishna says that He is beyond the Prakruti (Kshara or Kshetra). However, He says that He is the best among the souls (Akshara). In this verse, the word ‘Atita’ means ‘beyond’. The word Uttama means the best among the category of souls. Since a realized soul is Brahman, he is the best among all the souls. Since the soul is beyond the body in view of the eternality, the word Atita is used in this context. Therefore, this makes clear that there are only two categories, the first is Purusha (soul), and the second is Prakruti (body or inert world).

Respondent: When you say that there are only two categories i.e., soul and body only, how can you include the soul in Prakruti under the sub-division Paraprakruti? In such case, the soul and body are Prakruti and God is Purusha. In such case, there are only two categories (Purusha and Prakruti), because the soul and body are in one category only.

Petitioner: It is said that the Paraprakruti is Jiiva or subtle body in the Gita (Jiiva Bhutam) and not the Atman (causal body). Therefore, the Paraprakruti is the subtle body and not the soul.

Mediator: If the subtle body is Paraprakruti, it is said that the Paraprakruti maintains the entire world (Yayedim Dharyte Jagat) in the same verse. However, the subtle body is not maintaining the world. Since the inert energy is maintaining the world, the soul here must refer to its basic essential form, which is the inert energy. Therefore, here the soul in the state of a bundle of qualities (subtle body) is to be taken, it should be taken in its basic form of inert energy as attained in the state of deep sleep. Here the word Jiiva cannot refer to the subtle body and the causal body also. It must refer only to the soul in deep sleep, which is inert energy. The word causal body means the standstill awareness of a realized soul. The soul in the state of vibrations (subtle body) as found in the states of awakening and dream cannot be referred in this verse.

Respondent: As the mediator explained, it is proved that the soul in all the states (awakening, dream, meditation and deep sleep) can come under only the category of Prakruti only. However, we can show the reference in the Gita about the mention of the soul as standstill awareness also under the category of Prakruti. It is mentioned that ‘Chetana’, which is just the pure awareness (Suddha chit), is mentioned in the category of Kshetram, which represents the body or Prakruti.

Petitioner: The word Purusha means the awareness that is lying in the body. Therefore, You cannot keep the awareness in the category of Prakruti or body.

Respondent: The word Purusha refers to Lord only frequently in the Veda. It is said that this world is the body of the Lord in the Veda (Prithvi Shariiram, Vishwaatmanam etc.). If you are particular of a limited living body only, you can take the human body of the human incarnation, in which the God is existing. When the Lord said, “Idam Shariiram”, it indicates the pious body of the Lord or the pious body of a great devotee like Arjuna, who is participating in the divine mission. It is not referring to every human body. When the Lord told ‘this body’, there is no need of introducing an alternative word “Kshetram” here. If He wanted to tell the alternative words for body, other alternative words must have been also mentioned. Therefore, the word Kshetram means the pious gross body, which is like Varanasi city. The word Kshetram is explained as the collection of five elements, various qualities and pure awareness (Chetana). The gross body consisting of the five elements is like the pious city. The bundle of qualities (subtle body) is like the pious temple. The pure awareness is like the innermost room (Garbhalaya). God is like the pious lingam in it. The lingam is beyond the Garbhalaya, temple (Devalaya) and the city. Similarly, God is beyond the gross, subtle and innermost causal bodies. Such God denoted by silence is beyond Vishwa (gross), Tejasa (subtle) and Prajna (causal) bodies as explained in the Veda. Now, here the causal body (or even the subtle body, which is made of the causal body) has the property of awareness and so is Kshetrajna. Now, God inside the causal body also is Kshetrajna, which means God also has the property of awareness and can also wish.

Here, the two words, ‘cha’ and ‘api’ are very important. These two words mean that even though God is unimaginable and not any item of creation and therefore, not awareness, still the Lord has the property of awareness. The reason is that the Lord being omnipotent can have any property because He is the chief source of everything. The soul is like the personal room of the Lord in the house (gross body). The owner is not restricted to that room only and can move anywhere in the house. Similarly, God can pervade all the three bodies in the human incarnation if necessary. If you take here, God can be Purusha and all the three bodies are Prakruti. If you take the soul as Purusha, God is the third item, called as Purushottama, who is beyond both Kshara and Akshara, which are the two imaginable items. The word Atita can refer to both Kshara and Akshara according to grammar. The word Uttama (superlative degree) means the best because Akshara is better than Kshara and God is better than Akshara. If your version is correct the word uttara (comparative degree) must be there. If you take the case of a devotee, you can take the gross body as a city, the subtle body is the temple and the causal body is in the position of God. In this case, the Garbhalaya is included in the temple. If the city is not referred here, the gross and the subtle body can be the temple and the causal body is like God (Deho Devalayah). In the human incarnation, all the three bodies constitute the temple and God is the shrine. If the concepts are clear, there is no confusion in the classification because sometimes the sub-division is also considered as the main division. The number of classified items varies because of the variation in the nature of the classification.

Mediator: If the soul is made of awareness, which is the root cause of the whole creation, there is no objection because the word Prakruti need not be taken in the sense of the effect only. This word can be also taken as the cause. The Sanskrit dictionary says that Prakruti means the root cause (prakrutirmulakarane). The word Prakruti can be said as the cause that is responsible for the best work (prakrishtam kriyate Anaya iti). In such case, the soul can be called as Para Prakruti and at the same time, can stand as the root cause of the creation. Such soul or awareness can be also Purusha as per its definition.

Respondent: If you call the soul as the root cause based on the dictionary, I cannot object you on that way but the objection comes because the other items mentioned in the Apara Prakruti are products. The Para and Apara are the two sub-divisions of Prakruti. You cannot say one sub-division as product and another sub division as cause.

Petitioner: We can take the word Prakruti in the sense of the inherent nature. This word is mentioned in that sense also in the Gita (Prakrutim yanti...). The Para Prakruti means the best nature of the Brahman, which means the real nature. That means it itself is Brahman. Thus, the soul becomes the Brahman.

Respondent: In such case, the Apara Prakruti also must be the other nature of Brahman. Nature being common, there cannot be distinction between Para and Apara. In such case, all the created world (products) also becomes the nature of the Brahman. This means that world itself is Brahman. There is no distinction between cause and effect. This is the concept of science and atheism.

Petitioner: The Brahma sutra says that the soul is not a modification of the food. It is independent awareness (vikarat netichet na prachuryat). Since it is not the product, it can be taken as the cause of the world.

Respondent: If something is not the product of another specific item, it does not mean that something is the root cause of the world. That Brahma Sutra is referring to the Vedic statement “Purushah annarasa mayah”. If you take the Vedic statement “annat Purushah”, it means that the soul is the product of the food. If you go to the beginning of this statement, it starts telling that space came from atman (inert energy), air came from space, fire came from air etc. When you say that pot is produced from the mud, it shall not mean that the mud by itself can produce the pot. The pot maker, wheel, fire, water etc., are responsible for the production of the pot. Therefore, you cannot say that the pot is the direct modification (vikara) of mud. Thus, in all these productions, the will of the God is necessary, without which the production cannot take place. The sand particles in course of time form an aggregate, called as stone and here the pot maker etc., are not required. Such modification of sand into stone is direct modification (vikara). Though food is the cause of the soul, the will of God must also be associated for such production of the soul from food. It is not a direct modification. The same sense is also referred to annarasamaya. The word maya (mayat) refers to the direct modification. Such direct modification is opposed by the Brahma Sutra and the same sense also exists in annat Purushah. Here, the Vedic statement is referring to the soul, which is made of inert energy that is produced from the food by the will of God.

The soul is associated with the inert energy (annarasa) that is supplied to the soul. The soul is like the ice block that is formed from water. Suppose the ice block is in a beaker of water. Since water is the same in the condensed ice also, we can say that the ice is associated with mostly water. The quantity of water in the ice is very less because the ice block is very small. Thus, the “mayat” is used in the sense of majority (prachuryam). Though the ice is consisting of the same water, it is less but its individuality is maintained. The surrounding water is perfectly homogenous with the ice. But it is in liquid phase, which is different from the solid ice. Actually, the soul creates the dream with help of this inert energy supplied from the food. When the soul (jiiva) leaves the body, the condensed inert energy as a solid containing the strong feelings from several births (samskaras) leaves the body. Thus, the central chip is missing. Therefore, even if you introduce the inert energy into dead body, the original chip, which is responsible for individual behaviour is not appearing. But the chip (jiiva) that comes out of the body is surrounded by another energetic body (Yatana Shariiram). Thus, the jiiva, who escaped in the above body will have the same behaviour of the dead person. Here, the Brahman and soul differ because Brahman is unimaginable and is creating the universe with its associated inert energy (Mula Maya). The soul also creates the dream with its associated inert energy but the soul is made of the same inert energy as a bundle of specified individual qualities (samskaras) collected from previous births. Another difference is that Brahman is the cause for the inert energy associated with it. In the case of the soul, the inert energy supplied from the food is associating with the Jiiva. Due to such differences, Brahman cannot be the soul.

To be continued...

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