Maha Satsanga on Tarka Shastra

O Learned and Devoted Servants of God,

Following is a mahā satsaṅga (grand spiritual discussion) between Swami and Shri J.S.R. Prasad, Professor of Sanskrit, who specializes in tarka śāstra (logic), at the Hyderabad Central University, Hyderabad.

Shri J.S.R. Prasad:- What is the relationship between logic (tarka shastra) and science?

Swami replied:- Both are one and the same. In both, the items of the creation are discussed well (tarkyante padaarthaah asmin iti tarkah). The logic was well developed in ancient India by the intellectual exercises of various ancient Sanskrit scholars. Today, science is doing the same analysis of items of creation. The merit of science over logic is that science verifies every concept through experimental work with the help of equipment setup in a practical laboratory. Due to this advantage of science, very few numbers of concepts were found correct in science surpassing the ancient Indian logic. For example, sound is said to be the property of space by ancient logic whereas science proves that it is wrong since sound cannot travel in absolute space. The moving molecules of air can only receive the sound and transfer it by mutual collisions. Hence, sound travels in air only. Sound is just mechanical energy. In the space, several horrible sounds are generated, which are not received by earth due to absence of air in the space. Above the earth, air exists upto certain distance only. Of course, space is required for the moving particles of air. Due to this, we can’t take the space as a contributor for the propagation of sound energy. Space exists in every element of all the five elements and hence, space can’t be specified to air only for this purpose.

The property of space is volume (parimaanam). You can’t quote the scripture - Gita for this wrong concept (shabdah khe) because, scripture might have been polluted with insertions. Even though, logic is defeated by science in this way, science is also defeated since it can’t explain about the unimaginable God. Hence, both logic and science belong to the domain of imaginable creation. Within the limits of imaginable creation, science can be more authentic due to its experimental proof. Science may defeat logic like Bhima defeating Duryodhana. But science is defeated by the spiritual knowledge confined to unimaginable God like the defeat of Bhima by Aanjaneya. Science has still, a role in spiritual knowledge. If an item (of creation) is misunderstood as unimaginable God, such item can be analysed by science and can be identified as imaginable or unimaginable. If science concludes such item as imaginable, we can clearly understand that such imaginable item is not the unimaginable God. For example, the Advaita philosophers believed that awareness is the ultimate unimaginable God. But, science proves that the awareness is only a specific work-form of inert energy only. When the inert energy functions in a specific nervous system, the inert energy is transformed into a specific work, called ‘awareness’, which is nothing but transfer of information from senses to brain through moving neurons in the nerves. Such awareness, an imaginable nervous energy transformed into specific work, can’t be unimaginable God, the ultimate cause of the universe. Of course, scripture has already captured this concept by saying that awareness is generated from food (annaat purushah – Veda, annaat bhavanti bhutani – Gita). The ultimate God can’t be generated from anything like awareness since He is the ultimate generator of this whole universe without any cause above Him.

Shri J.S.R. Prasad:- Some say that music is a path to salvation. What is Your opinion?

Swami replied:- Certainly, music is a path to the development of devotion. Devotion is said to be the emotional feeling or love towards God (paramapremaruupaa – Narada Bhakti Sutram). The music must generate this feeling, in which case only music can be the path of devotion. The music is involved in a song, which generates feeling or love to God. Here, mere sound energy of the music or the words of the song can’t generate any feeling. Certain tunes of music may generate a feeling provided the receiver is already acquainted with the feeling that is connected to a specific tune. Similarly, the words of the song must also generate the feeling through their meanings. A tape recorder generating a musical and devotional song can’t get salvation because, it doesn’t feel at all! The tape recorder is inert and God sees only the feelings of a non-inet devotee (Bhaavagraahii Janaardanah). Similarly, a tape recorder uttering the Vedic hymns can’t generate any miracle because, God has to generate the miracle based on the feeling of the tape recorder, which is not possible! Only a human being can feel by uttering the Vedic hymns or by singing a devotional song. Based on such feeling of the devotee, God generates the miracle provided God is pleased with that feeling. Feeling comes only from the meaning of the words. Meaning of the words is a concept of knowledge. Hence, knowledge alone develops feeling or love to God in the heart of the devotee and this leads to the salvation granted by the pleased God.

The sound is said to be of two types:- 1. Aahata Naada, which means the sound generated by the movements of tongue, teeth and palates. 2. Anaahata Naada, which is the sound generated as above that causes feeling in the heart in which anaahata-chakra exists. This distinction is not of much significance because, the feeling coming from heart generates the first type of sound or the first type of sound generates feeling in the heart. If the first type of sound is not generating any feeling in the heart due to the meaning of the words uttered being not understood by the receiver, there is no reaction from God since such sound energy is useless causing sound pollution only. All this analysis strictly applies to the priests blindly reciting the Vedic hymns without understanding the meaning of any word and this concludes that the ritual done by such priest along with the performer of the ritual does not get any benefit. Knowledge (Jnana Yoga) is the first step involving the understanding of the divine personality of God generating the second step, called devotion (Bhakti Yoga) or love. Such devotion must be practically proved by practical service and practical sacrifice in the third step (Karma Yoga). Hearing the details of Mumbai city is the first step. Attraction developed to see the Mumbai city is the second step. Both these steps are theoretical and third step is practical. In the third step, the person travels (service) to the railway station and purchases ticket to Mumbai city to reach it (sacrifice). These three steps were preached in the same sequence, by Shankara, Ramanuja and Madhva, who came in the same sequence of time. Shankara condemned the philosophy of Purva-Mimamsaa preaching that sound energy itself is divine (Sabdamaatra Devataa) to do any miracle.

Shri J.S.R. Prasad:- The atheists are denying God due to the absence of the authority of perception. What do you say about this?

Swami replied:- In all the authorities of ancient logic, perception is pervading everywhere in the background. The authorities are:- 1. Pratyaksham or perception involves seeing an item and deriving its knowledge through deduction (direct knowledge). 2. Anumaanam or inference is the authority of knowledge derived (through induction or indirect knowledge) about the unseen fire on hill by seeing the smoke coming down. The link between fire and smoke is already seen in the kitchen. 3. Upamaanam or analogy is the authority of knowledge derived by comparison of unseen item with the seen item. The unseen animal called ‘gavaya’ is understood from its comparison with animal called gow (cow). Here, the compared animal is imagined by us through the seen animal and the source of knowledge has seen both the animals. 4. Shabda or verbal testimony is the authority of knowledge derived by us from a reliable person, who has seen an item that is not seen by us. 5. Arthaapatti or implication is knowledge derived by us from untold clause. Example:– the stout person is not eating food in the day time. Here, eating in the night time is implied because without eating in day and night, it must result in emaciation and death also. This fact that a person becoming lean without food is seen by us. 6. Anupalabdhi or non-recognition is the knowledge derived by us about a subtle item that is not seen by us, but seen by the source of knowledge with the help of special equipment. X-rays are present in the atmosphere, but these rays are very subtle and not perceived by us with our eyes. We have perceived only the absence of X-rays. But, this existence of X-rays in atmosphere was perceived by a scientist with the help of a powerful microscope. Hence, in all the six authorities of derivation of knowledge, perception is inevitable. Therefore, people depending on logic and science require the perception-proof of the existence of unimaginable God.

The Veda says that God is recognized through perception itself (yat saakshaat aparokshaat Brahma). We say that God is unimaginable and hence, is expressed through silence only. We are seeing genuine miracles clearly demonstrated by the spiritual people. Miracles are unimaginable actions, the source of which must be unimaginable God only and can’t be any imaginable item of the creation. The Advaita philosophers misunderstood and misled all of us by saying that awareness being imaginable perceived item, it is God. If you say that perception is the characteristic of God, any perceived item of this world must be God (ativyaapti or extrapolation). Here, the final essence is that the unimaginable God is understood by the authority of perception. Since, miracles infer the existence of unimaginable God and since miracles are perceivable by us (though not understood since unimaginable), God is already told as unimaginable by the Veda (yato vaacho.., yo buddheh paratah.., naishaa tarkena.., atarkyah.., na medhayaa... etc.). Here, the word ‘unimaginable’ means that the nature of God is not imaginable, which is not perceivable. But, the existence of unimaginable nature and the unimaginable God (possessor of such unimaginable nature) is inferred by the seen unimaginable events called miracles.

The Veda says that the existence of unimaginable God can be easily understood by us with the help of the authority of perception or the other authorities based on perception (astiityevopalabdhavyah) of miracles. When the unimaginable God is mediated by a human being like the son of Vasudeva (Krishna), such human being becomes unimaginable God by perfect merge. The perception of such divine person performing the unimaginable events is the direct perception of unimaginable God only. In every generation, the incarnations of God Datta are performing several miracles for the sake of the authority for the perception of unimaginable God called Parabrahman. By such perception, the devotee experiences the unimaginable God (anubhavaikavedyam Brahma). Hence, scientists and atheists need not blame that God is not perceived. If you argue that the Veda also says that God can’t be seen, you can apply such Vedic statements (na chakshusaa pashyati, na tatra chakshuh...) in non-mediated unimaginable God. In the case of non-mediated unimaginable God also, knowledge of His existence is attained through inference by directly perceiving the miracles, which are the inherent characteristics of unimaginable God only. Therefore, we can get the proof of existence in the case of non-mediated unimaginable God and we can get the direct perception-proof of unimaginable God through mediated unimaginable God (because the unimaginable God merged with the medium perfectly results in monism only and not dualism.). Therefore, we call Krishna as the direct Parabrahman (Sri Krishna Parabrahmane Namah). The Veda also says that one blessed devotee has seen (means recognised) the unimaginable God (kashchit dhiirah pratyagaatmaanamaikshat, tasyaisha atmaa vivrunute tanuum svaam). The Gita also says that one rare devotee comes to know (identify) the existence of unimaginable God along with perception (kashchit maam vetti tattvatah). When one sees God Krishna, both perception of unimaginable God (because unimaginable God perfectly merged with Krishna through monism) and recognition of Krishna as unimaginable God through inference (through the seen miracles performed by Krishna like lifting mountain) are achieved by the devotee.

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